Basic Fantasy RPG Core Rules 4th Edition

[Dimirag]

I don't want to jinx it, but we may be getting close.

Anulo mufa!!! (something we say, similar to "I cancel jinx", it was very very used during the world cup)

[JugglinDan]

[peelseel2]

Why did sleep get more powerful in 4th edition? Stayed the same in all iterations, but now it can be used on 4hd and 5hd creatures?

[Boggo]

Why did sleep get more powerful in 4th edition? Stayed the same in all iterations, but now it can be used on 4hd and 5hd creatures?

ogres

And it explicitly says it DOESN'T affect 5HD and higher monsters, it was just tidying up the weird upper limit that was only there to mean it affected Ogres. it was just tidying up the description

[Solomoriah]

Yeah, what Boggo said. There was a hole: The spell as formerly written definitely affected 3HD and lower, and definitely did not affect 5HD and higher, but somehow 4HD was left out.

[Dimirag]

Weird, my print copy (thanks chii for the gift) has it afecting up to 3hd with 4hd and above being immune.

I guess it got changed to 3/5 at some point...

[Solomoriah]

... actually, the "hole" was created during SRD removal. I didn't realize that until now.

But in the coverage target game (BX) the line was set a bit higher, and after years of experience with the game I agree.

[peelseel2]

The wording now does not preclude putting an entire party for 4th-level adventurers to sleep (assuming they do not save) using 1 first-level sleep. I always thought the wording was there to make it explicit that 4 HD was not affected because of the lack of how many HD was affected. In the common era represented, it always only affected 1 4+1 creature if used.

The wording never had a weird 4 hd exception. It was explicit.

r.62:
This spell puts several creatures of 3 or fewer hit dice into
a magical slumber. Creatures of 4 or more hit dice are not
affected.

r.107:
This spell puts several creatures of 3 or fewer hit dice into
a magical slumber. Creatures of 4 or more hit dice are not
affected.

[Dimirag]

The wording never had a weird 4 hd exception. It was explicit.

The 4hd exception started after r107, on the 4th edition "to do" list, you won't see it on any of the 3rd edition releases.
It appeared as a typing error or when some spells where slightly changed to avoid falling into the srd. (maybe both).

[peelseel2]

I just think the spell in 4th edition is a lot more powerful now. I think it should be the same 'power' as the 1-3 edition, if only for backward compatibility.