Equipment Emporium Supplement

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Solomoriah
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Re: Equipment Emporium Supplement

Post by Solomoriah »

Thanks! I actually just noticed that yesterday, or maybe the day before.

I really need to get a new release done so everyone is on the same pages...
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Re: Equipment Emporium Supplement

Post by Solomoriah »

Announcing!

Basic Fantasy Equipment Emporium, Release 28 -- March 23, 2023
This is the first Print Release Candidate for the new CC BY-SA release of this book.

https://basicfantasy.org/downloads.html ... ntemporium
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JugglinDan
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Re: Equipment Emporium Supplement

Post by JugglinDan »

First, let me say that I love this book and have been using the print version in the weekly game I've been running since December. This is also my first time trying to join this community by proof-reading something. Apologies if I get it wrong or refer to issues you already know about.

Release 28:
  • pages 3 & 4: the ** footnotes about weapons that only do subduing damage refer to the core rules page 48. But in Core rules R118, subduing damage is on page 55.
  • Page 8: reference to falling damage on page 52 in core rules. This is now on page 59.
  • Page 31: refers to leopard/panther on page 107 in the core rules. This animal is on page 120 now.
  • Page 31: reference to core rules antelope on page 56. Antelope is now page 64.
  • Page 31: reference to field guide volume 1 wild ram will need updating for the combined volume. I suggest removing the page number from the reference.
  • Page 32: 3 references to core rules with incorrect page numbers - boar, crocodiles, dogs.
  • Page 33: Incorrectly numbered core rules references to giant weasel, rat, 3 types of snake
  • Page 35: Services table gives page 42 for hirelings, now 46.
  • Page 44: In the Entangling Weapons section, there's another incorrect page reference to Subuing Damage in the core rules.
  • Page 47: The introductory sentence to the revised magic items table gives page 132 in the core rules as the location of the magic weapon and armour tables. These are now on page 165.
For all of these, I think it would be less fragile if the references were to a named section of the core rules without giving a page number. This approach is used elsewhere in EE.

Page 19: In the descriptions of Wizards' Wares, Wyvern ink is mentioned. However, the table on page 17 does not list Wyvern ink. It lists "writing ink". While it's easy to see they are intended to be the same thing, I think it would be better if the naming was consistent. Or maybe they are not the same thing. In that case the table is missing "wyvern ink", and the description section is missing "writing ink". It's not fully clear in either case.

Hardness: The first mention of hardness is on page 29 in the description of chests. It is listed again in the vehicles table (page 40). It's not until page 41 that the reader is directed to the core rules for explanations of hardness. Is it worth mentioning this earlier in the book when hardness is first used? Also, would it be helpful to have hardness as a column on the storage & containers table, or will that mess with the layout too much?

Page 44: The final sentence in example 1 of Special Weapon Features has some errors. It reads "they also decides that these weapons take greater care (a role-playing issue), and are especially tasty to ironbane." There is unexpected bolding on the first word "they" which is also not capitalised. Also, double spaces after the last period which doesn't match. My grammar checker suggests the comma after "issue)" is not required either. Finally, are names of creatures typically capitalised? "Ironbane" or "ironbane"? I suspect this sentence should read something like "They also decide that these weapons require greater care (a role-playing issue) and are especially tasty to ironbane."

Page 44: Unusual Materials and High Quality Items. "They" is bolded in the sentence "If the GM chooses, they may assign bonuses or penalties to equipment of unusual make." This looks odd.

I'll keep reading today and will add to this post if I find anything else.
I'm done. That's all I could find.
Last edited by JugglinDan on Fri Mar 24, 2023 11:24 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Equipment Emporium Supplement

Post by Solomoriah »

Wow. I'll need you to PM me your name as you want it in the credits...
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Re: Equipment Emporium Supplement

Post by JugglinDan »

Woo! This makes my day!

I was inspired to start proofreading by two things - my love of this game, and your YouTube video about the Basic Fantasy Project. I thought "hey, I've done open-source software. Why not open-source RPGs?".

I read the first half of Core Rules 118 last night but could find nothing other than the already known inconsistent use of ' and feet, and some slight discomfort at the wording of Passwall.
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Re: Equipment Emporium Supplement

Post by chiisu81 »

Good catches 8-)
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Re: Equipment Emporium Supplement

Post by Solomoriah »

JugglinDan wrote: Fri Mar 24, 2023 10:10 pm First, let me say that I love this book and have been using the print version in the weekly game I've been running since December. This is also my first time trying to join this community by proof-reading something. Apologies if I get it wrong or refer to issues you already know about.

Release 28:
  • pages 3 & 4: the ** footnotes about weapons that only do subduing damage refer to the core rules page 48. But in Core rules R118, subduing damage is on page 55.
  • Page 8: reference to falling damage on page 52 in core rules. This is now on page 59.
  • Page 31: refers to leopard/panther on page 107 in the core rules. This animal is on page 120 now.
  • Page 31: reference to core rules antelope on page 56. Antelope is now page 64.
  • Page 31: reference to field guide volume 1 wild ram will need updating for the combined volume. I suggest removing the page number from the reference.
  • Page 32: 3 references to core rules with incorrect page numbers - boar, crocodiles, dogs.
  • Page 33: Incorrectly numbered core rules references to giant weasel, rat, 3 types of snake
  • Page 35: Services table gives page 42 for hirelings, now 46.
  • Page 44: In the Entangling Weapons section, there's another incorrect page reference to Subuing Damage in the core rules.
  • Page 47: The introductory sentence to the revised magic items table gives page 132 in the core rules as the location of the magic weapon and armour tables. These are now on page 165.
For all of these, I think it would be less fragile if the references were to a named section of the core rules without giving a page number. This approach is used elsewhere in EE.
I've fixed most of these things as you have given them. I did go ahead and move weasels over to the Core Rules (didn't even break the flow) so now there will be another release... gah.
JugglinDan wrote: Fri Mar 24, 2023 10:10 pm Page 19: In the descriptions of Wizards' Wares, Wyvern ink is mentioned. However, the table on page 17 does not list Wyvern ink. It lists "writing ink". While it's easy to see they are intended to be the same thing, I think it would be better if the naming was consistent. Or maybe they are not the same thing. In that case the table is missing "wyvern ink", and the description section is missing "writing ink". It's not fully clear in either case.
"Writing ink" does not need a description, IMO. I had intended to remove Wyvern Ink outright, as I do not really want any more optional rules than necessary in this book. If it belongs anywhere, it's in Magic-User Options.
JugglinDan wrote: Fri Mar 24, 2023 10:10 pm Hardness: The first mention of hardness is on page 29 in the description of chests. It is listed again in the vehicles table (page 40). It's not until page 41 that the reader is directed to the core rules for explanations of hardness. Is it worth mentioning this earlier in the book when hardness is first used? Also, would it be helpful to have hardness as a column on the storage & containers table, or will that mess with the layout too much?
Good point. I've moved the information to the table and added a note at the bottom.
JugglinDan wrote: Fri Mar 24, 2023 10:10 pm Page 44: The final sentence in example 1 of Special Weapon Features has some errors. It reads "they also decides that these weapons take greater care (a role-playing issue), and are especially tasty to ironbane." There is unexpected bolding on the first word "they" which is also not capitalised. Also, double spaces after the last period which doesn't match. My grammar checker suggests the comma after "issue)" is not required either. Finally, are names of creatures typically capitalised? "Ironbane" or "ironbane"? I suspect this sentence should read something like "They also decide that these weapons require greater care (a role-playing issue) and are especially tasty to ironbane."
Automatic pronoun changes went badly here. I've done some rewriting as well as fixing a font issue.
JugglinDan wrote: Fri Mar 24, 2023 10:10 pm Page 44: Unusual Materials and High Quality Items. "They" is bolded in the sentence "If the GM chooses, they may assign bonuses or penalties to equipment of unusual make." This looks odd.
Font issue. Fixed.
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Re: Equipment Emporium Supplement

Post by JugglinDan »

Solomoriah wrote: Sat Mar 25, 2023 12:55 pm
JugglinDan wrote: Fri Mar 24, 2023 10:10 pm Page 19: In the descriptions of Wizards' Wares, Wyvern ink is mentioned. However, the table on page 17 does not list Wyvern ink. It lists "writing ink". While it's easy to see they are intended to be the same thing, I think it would be better if the naming was consistent. Or maybe they are not the same thing. In that case the table is missing "wyvern ink", and the description section is missing "writing ink". It's not fully clear in either case.
"Writing ink" does not need a description, IMO. I had intended to remove Wyvern Ink outright, as I do not really want any more optional rules than necessary in this book. If it belongs anywhere, it's in Magic-User Options.
This makes sense. I didn't consider moving wyvern ink to another supplement, but that is cleaner.
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Re: Equipment Emporium Supplement

Post by JugglinDan »

After finishing my pass over CC, I've got time for more proofreading. I can do another read-through of EE, but if my time will be better spent on the Core Rules, BF1, or something else please let me know.
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Re: Equipment Emporium Supplement

Post by JugglinDan »

Status: complete

Ok, I'm doing a read-through of EE r29. Will update this post as I find things, and again when I'm finished.

R29:

* all the body text is 9.5pt. I think this is as small as you should go.

* TOC: Needs updating. Some items are incorrectly named in the TOC because the heading has been changed but the TOC not updated. Some items are missing for the same reason. Examples: siege engines has a rogue "New Items" entry but there is no heading for that anymore. Tack and Harness and Tack and Harness Descriptions are missing from the TOC.

* I'm suggesting that the heading levels applied to different areas need revisiting so that items nest correctly or don't appear in the TOC. Example in the image below. The three highlighted entries are actually sub-items to "Details and Descriptions", with descriptions for each of the corresponding tables that appear just above in the TOC. This would also avoid the confusion caused by having identical text appear in the TOC twice. Note how the text "Game, Farm, and Livestock", "Guards and hunting", and "Pets and Other Animals" appears twice in the TOC.
EE TOC
EE TOC
Screenshot 2023-04-04 193142.jpg (64.36 KiB) Viewed 436 times
* Following from the last point, are the subheading levels right in the Game Master's Information section? EQUIPMENT is clearly a higher-level heading than "Specialty Tools & Quality Tools" yet both are style SubHeading with the font size overridden on the latter to 9.5 instead of 11. The same remarks apply to the other sub-sub-headings in EQUIPMENT, and to the subsequent TREASURE section.

* Page 44: Font issue in "Unusual Materials and High Quality Items". Most of the heading is in 9.5pt, while "High" is 11pt. Other sub-headings are 11pt.

* To hyphenate or not? This one doesn't have a page number and is very much a question of taste. I normally hyphenate things like "high-quality". I won't mention this again though, as I suspect a preference towards less hyphenation here.

* Why do we have "Great Axe" and "Great Mace" but "Greatclub" is a single word? Is this based on historic precedent? Also, in most sources I can find "morningstar" is two words - "morning star". Quarterstaff is correctly a single word.

* In the weapons table we have "shortsword" and "longsword", both one word. But in the descriptions these are "short sword" and "long sword" respectively. Both one and two-word forms appear in common use, but it would be nice to have internal consistency.

* Page 7: In the description of heavy crossbows, I think that "heavy crossbows can fire 1 per 3 rounds" reads better as "heavy crossbows can fire once per 3 rounds".

* Page 8: There's another numbered page reference to the core rules - "falling damage on page 59...". While this is the correct page number for r126, these numbers are fragile. I suggest something like "see Falling Damage in Part 5 of the Basic Fantasy Core Rules for more details".

* Pages 7 & 13: On page 7, we have "short bows" and "long bows" while on page 13 we have "shortbow" and "longbow". I think page 7 is the one to change. Most other sources use the single word forms for both. Of course, we could side with Emerson and state that "a foolish consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds". That's fine with me too. I mention these things in case they matter enough to others to change them before print.

* Page 14 font issues:
- In Silk Rope description, "above" in the last sentence is in Soutane instead of Soutane BF.
- In "Outdoors" section, the "is" after "Air Bladder" is bolded in the first sentence.
- In Outdoors section, third line, "their" is in the wrong font.

* Page 15 font issues:
- final sentence of Trap description: "their" in the wrong font. Cut and paste error?

* Page 19: In the Alchemy lab section, is "some" in "creating potions and some magic item creation" meant to be italicised? Sure, it adds emphasis, but in other parts of the book bold text is used for emphasis. See for example "(not magical)" in the Books & Tomes section on the same page.

* Page 19: Should "Small Winds" be "Small Wind Instruments"?

* Page 20 font issues:
- Barrette: "person's hair with"
- Circlet: double space between "is a" and "small" in "is a small crown"
- Monocle: this paragraph is 9pt, smaller than the rest at 9.5pt.

* Page 22: in the table "beltpouch" should be "belt pouch"
* Page 22: satchel or haversack section includes "handaxe" instead of "hand axe"
* Page 24: "Hats & Headcover" reads better as "Hats & Headcovers". If changed, the heading on page 25 should also change to match.
* Page 25 font issue: "their" in the Headband description.
* Page 26 fonts: "one's appearance" in first paragraph of Outerwear section.
* Page 27:
- "Kilts are a kind of skirt" has a double space after kilts.
- Trousers or Trews: The sentence "Trousers or Trews are a garments..." should lose the "a".
- Trousers or Trews: The sentence "Trews are tighter fitting than trousers but still looser than leggings and are plaid like kilts" is missing a full stop.
- Trousers or Trews: The sentence "The plaid pattern is again" has a double space before "is".
- Shoes: "allows a Thief a better": "a" is the wrong font.
- Snowshoes: "their" is in mismatched font.

* Page 28: fragile reference to Core Rules page 60.

* Page 29: saddle bags section: another two "their" words in the wrong font.

* Page 30: not an error, more a question: How will the reference to the field guides change with the planned combined field guide? Will supplements still refer to "Field Guide Volume 1" like this page? Or will they just say "Field Guide"?

* Page 31: The sentence about cougars and pumas has a fragile reference to Mountain Lion on page 120 of the Core Rules. In r126 Mountain Lions are on page 129 and this could change again. I suggest changing "(Basic Fantasy RPG Core Rules, p 120)." to "(see Mountain Lion in the Basic Fantasy RPG Core Rules)."

* Page 31: Deer refers to Antelope on page 64. Again, this risks breaking.
* Page 32: Pig refers to Boar on core rules page 70.
* Page 32: Crocodile refers to core rules page 75.
* Page 32: Dog refers to core rules page 78.
* Page 32: Ferret refers to core rules page 156.

I don't mind all these specific page references. They are clearly helpful. But they can also be broken easily as the flow changes in the other books. If it is decided to change them, then they are sprinkled throughout the animals section of EE. I'm not going to list them further.

* Page 33, homing pigeon: double space after "Homing Pigeon".

* Page 39, lamps: "candleholders" is usually spelt "candle holders".

* Page 41, galleys: double space after "to" in "but need to anchor near a shore".
* Page 42: double space after "expensive" in "is expensive with not much".
* Page 42: I think "There are two basic versions of Sail: square and triangular." should have "Sails" plural.

* Page 44: Yep, Entangling Weapons has a numbered page reference to subduing damage.
* Page 45: Odd font "their" in first paragraph of "Piece mail armor" section.

* Page 47: numbered page reference to Core Rules.
Last edited by JugglinDan on Tue Apr 04, 2023 6:41 am, edited 9 times in total.
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