Basic Fantasy RPG with a D&D Logo slapped on it?

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Ironwolf
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Basic Fantasy RPG with a D&D Logo slapped on it?

Post Sun Nov 19, 2017 11:29 am

Has anyone here seen this?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D7bbBJgD5FM

If Chris has no problem with this, that's cool. But it seems odd that this guy is taking the work Chris did, calling it "Dungeons & Dragons", and asking for donations for doing so.
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Dimirag
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Re: Basic Fantasy RPG with a D&D Logo slapped on it?

Post Sun Nov 19, 2017 11:58 am

I feel kind of weird about it, its a lazy attempt to do an alternate version, its the core game with some optional supplements slapped in between with no sense of cohesion into making it a full game.

Good points:
-He removed the pics, I hope he removed all of them.
Bad points:
-He still uses the name Basic Fantasy as he did not edit any file
-He removed the credits of every supplement, I hope he added every one at the end of the book

Kind of funny how he complains about stuff on the book that could have tinkered wit. Ok, just saw some videos, he just combined the pdfs and thus have made no mods to the game...

The worst part is the 5 bucks minimum collaboration group, I get that they will get any upgraded book for free, but the facebook thing feels kind of wrong, not letting non paying users from expressing ideas, opinions or questions...

What bothers me the most is that in his videos he never tells people to come to this site to get the original work, he better tell in on his "book"
Sorry for any misspelling or writing error, I am not a native English speaker
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Rules Cyclopedia Guy
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Re: Basic Fantasy RPG with a D&D Logo slapped on it?

Post Sun Nov 19, 2017 3:10 pm

Im the creator of this book.OK. lets start with the false accusations first. To start with i have given Chris credit and the viewers info that this is Basic Fantasy and where to download the original. its not a attempt to make a new game at all. its the same game. For the record i have lots of people that watch my channel and have turned many people onto the game. People are loving what im doing by putting all the supplements into one book and ive received tons of mail about it, so saying its "slapped together with no cohesion" is ridiculous. everything is in order and it works perfect. im not selling the book.if people want to donate to the time ive spent making this book they can. This is book is a compliment to Chris and i showed him my first draft. he said he cant post about it, but sent me a friend request and we have talked many times. I use a Rules Cyclopedia logo to commemorate a all in one game, which thats what this is. I use the BECMI pics and colors because thats what i grew up playing and i feel like this is the ultimate version of that game. so I "slapped" this all together from my own personal use, showed my viewers and people flipped, so im giving it for free with more to come. yes i have a private facebook group for those that donate, not that i have to explain that cause its irrelevant. Im a paid DM and Basic Fantasy is gonna be the rules set for my next campaign. I just made a character creation video and am working on many more videos to get the game out there more. The way i see it, Im doing a lot for this game right now and giving Basic Fantasy full credit. Our communities can come together or be separate. its up to you guys.
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Solomoriah
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Re: Basic Fantasy RPG with a D&D Logo slapped on it?

Post Sun Nov 19, 2017 3:16 pm

I'm going to copy here the post that I just put on Youtube, just in case it mysteriously disappears:

Let me start by saying this: Thank you for the kind words! I'm glad you like my game.

Sadly, I don't have any other words you are going to want to hear. You have violated the rules of the Open Game License, and more than that, you have gone big in your violation. First of all, section 7 of the OGL states that "You agree not to Use any Product Identity, including as an indication as to compatibility, except as expressly licensed in another, independent Agreement with the owner of each element of that Product Identity." The names Basic Fantasy Role-Playing Game (and its derivatives) are Product Identity which belong to me. I do offer a separate agreement, the Basic Fantasy Role-Playing Game Product Identity License, but the terms of that agreement do not allow you to create a derivative version of the Core Rules without changing the name.

The thing is, section 7 also says this: "You agree not to indicate compatibility or co-adaptability with any Trademark or Registered Trademark in conjunction with a work containing Open Game Content except as expressly licensed in another, independent Agreement with the owner of such Trademark or Registered Trademark." THAT would include the name "Dungeons and Dragons" which as we all know is property of Wizards of the Coast (and thus, Hasbro).

Your video above is itself a violation, since you are talking about your derivative game (where you have taken my work and the work of my many contributors and remixed them) and using both of the names listed above. You are not permitted to do this, not at all.

Note that if you presented that book as something you created for yourself, but which you were not distributing (to anyone, not even your best friend), there would be no violation. What you do for your own use is not affected by the license. But you say you are distributing this work, and this is illegal, a violation of the copyrights of the original materials.

Now here's the deal, Johnny. I don't care all that much. I've worked hard to keep my game legal; I never name other games in conjunction with mine, except for a short list of games for which I have arranged as "separate agreement" as given above. I distribute my game for free in PDF, and at or very close to cost in print; I do not have money to hire a lawyer.

Hasbro does not have this problem. I sincerely hope that this project of yours does not land you in court with them... I really do, I don't want to see that happen. But in case it comes up at some time in the future, let me say unequivocally that I do not approve of or agree to your usage of my material (including contributed material over which I have control), nor do I agree to your use of my Product Identity in conjunction with your product. As a matter of my own legal standing, I must object strenuously to your entire project on the grounds I've given above.

Please understand that I am not a lawyer, and I'm trying to avoid involving any, but as I understand it, you do not have to make money from your work in order to be in violation; simply sharing it in public counts as "distribution" and makes your product a violation. But the existence of actual print copies in the hands of anyone besides you would certainly qualify.
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Re: Basic Fantasy RPG with a D&D Logo slapped on it?

Post Sun Nov 19, 2017 3:49 pm

Well everything has been pulled down. The project ended. i was hoping to bring lots more fans to this game and will still continue to try and do so.
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Solomoriah
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Re: Basic Fantasy RPG with a D&D Logo slapped on it?

Post Sun Nov 19, 2017 4:11 pm

I'm sorry this happened to you. You are not the first person to have this idea, nor even the first to try it, but your choice to use the name of WoTC's game could have put you in grave legal trouble. I very honestly did not want to see that happen.
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Dimirag
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Re: Basic Fantasy RPG with a D&D Logo slapped on it?

Post Sun Nov 19, 2017 4:45 pm

Rules Cyclopedia Guy wrote:i was hoping to bring lots more fans to this game and will still continue to try and do so.
That's a nice thing to do, just tell people about the forum along with the game

If you are interested in presenting your house rules there are a couple of files around here that may help you with that.
Sorry for any misspelling or writing error, I am not a native English speaker
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SmootRK
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Re: Basic Fantasy RPG with a D&D Logo slapped on it?

Post Sun Nov 19, 2017 6:32 pm

Seems like a misjudgment that followed a major misunderstanding of the copyrights and OGL requirements. While it may have been largely innocent, the idea of collecting funds for such works sets off the alarm bells among those who (namely a bunch of us) that fully intend to share our efforts freely.

Just because we share freely, does not mean we intend for others to reap rewards on those efforts (even if small and based upon a donation mechanism).

That all said, best of luck with your campaigns and other gaming endeavors, whether BFRPG or otherwise.
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Solomoriah
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Re: Basic Fantasy RPG with a D&D Logo slapped on it?

Post Sun Nov 19, 2017 6:50 pm

One of the hard things to accept here, that we must accept, is that the OGL allows our freely-shared works to be monetized by others. There's no help for that, legally speaking, but by building a community around the game, we've acquired some protection socially. Getting traction selling a commercialized version of our game, with the limitation that you can't use the name, is hard work, and once you get noticed, people can easily discover that your game is not at all original. So while it's superficially attractive, it rarely actually happens and has never amounted to anything.

I was mostly concerned with potential hassles related to his use of our material, if WoTC decided to pursue him. I'd rather not be deposed, nor made to appear in court.
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Re: Basic Fantasy RPG with a D&D Logo slapped on it?

Post Sun Nov 19, 2017 9:04 pm

again, this book was created for my own personal use. I highly doubt WOTC would have came after me, but removed it out of respect for Chris. Im loving this game and honestly think its amazing so far. im still going to do videos about BF but im going to use the official books. i only shared because i was flooded with messages and got excited people were starting to see what i saw in the game. they were saying how genuinely excited they were i showed them. there honestly was nothing intentional, i figured as long as i wasnt selling anything, but Chris said free sharing is wrong too so i figured better shut her down and not give anything away anymore. Just please keep in mind I always gave Chris and the creators credit, i never said it was mine. Im sorry it was a honest mistake. Hope to interact with you guys on a different playing field at some point :)
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