Combination Classes Questions

[chatdemon]

The main issue I have with proliferating the multiclass options is that humans start to 'get the shaft', making them less desirable as a PC option, as happened in AD&D, and especially in AD&D 2nd. Any ideas for keeping the balance between the races so the players don't all insist on playing elves?

[saskganesh]

the 10% experience bonus humans get helps. also lower Hit Point Dice for Elves (no more than d6) and of course, slower rate of progressions for multi's as opposed to single class

roleplaying considerations can also play an important role. In my campaign, there is considerable shared xenophobia between elves and humans.

[Hywaywolf]

last night we brought a human NPC into the party and I half thought about leaving him because the damn fool can't see in the dark. Its hard to be stealthy at night carrying a torch around with you.

[SmootRK]

a fairly common sort of magic item are Goggles, glasses, helmets, etc of Darkvision... although I generally only allow short ranges (10 to 30 feet), only very expensive and highly magical versions have normal ranges equivalent to real Darkvision.

[Solomoriah]

last night we brought a human NPC into the party and I half thought about leaving him because the damn fool can't see in the dark. Its hard to be stealthy at night carrying a torch around with you.

Halflings don't see in the dark either. I guess you have no halflings?

Remember that Darkvision is black and white. A clever GM will make use of that by having colored murals, etc. to mess with the elves and dwarves who run around lightless all the time.

[chatdemon]

the 10% experience bonus humans get helps. also lower Hit Point Dice for Elves (no more than d6) and of course, slower rate of progressions for multi's as opposed to single class

But these things already exist in the rules. and supposedly at least, balance the other special abilities demihumans get.

I'm wondering if the answer is allowing a special multiclass combo that only humans can take?

[Hywaywolf]

last night we brought a human NPC into the party and I half thought about leaving him because the damn fool can't see in the dark. Its hard to be stealthy at night carrying a torch around with you.

Halflings don't see in the dark either. I guess you have no halflings?

Remember that Darkvision is black and white. A clever GM will make use of that by having colored murals, etc. to mess with the elves and dwarves who run around lightless all the time.

That's right, halflings don't have darkvision. whoops. I am the halfling in our group LOL. We haven't really operated in the dark yet.

[jdn2006]

My concepts are: humans aren't blind at night, not with moonlight (with bright moonlight they might see as well as darkvision depending on personal definitions.) I prefer to see darkvision as handy for complete darkness (no light at all, such as underground) not with low light from moon, stars, etc.

[Hywaywolf]

I hiked 1000 miles of the Appalachian Trail and spent a lot of time outside at night. when the moon is full it is practically daylight unless you are in a forest with a thick tree canopy. Even when there isn't much light you would be surprised how well you can see in the dark once you have been in the dark for 20 minutes or so and your eyes and brain have fully adjusted. But there has to be some light though and any light source will ruin it. In a cave or inside a room or under a thick forest canopy you are completely blind.

[celtchief]

"I can dig that should be only for elves. I only asked because it seems that so many people forget that a thief facing a known combat situation when he has access to metal armor, and time to change into and out of said armor, would be a pretty dumb PC not to take advantage of that opportunity."

My take on this is a thief is taught to fight in leather, not heavier armor. One of the things I DID like about 3.5 was that you could use weapons and armor you did not start out proficient in, but you had to take a feat to do so, representing training. A thief, presumably trained by the thieves guild or what not, is only trained in leather armor. Just because you put him in plate does not mean he can fight in it effectively. So, I think that justifies a thief not changing into plate or chain, just because he knows the fight is coming.

If a thief wants to fight in armor, then perhaps they can pay ALOT of money to a trainer to learn how to..... first chain, then breastplate, and then plate mail, each costing more. Perhaps this training costs them a 5 or 10 % penalty in thief skills or the loss of backstabbing...... just some thoughts.

Robert