Alternate Assassin for Basic Fantasy

[cbarchuk]

Will you look at it real quick as I removed the credits since I practically changed the whole thing.

If nothing on the file is a direct copy (text, table, images) from another supplement or file (either from BFRPG or from magazines or other games rules or supplements) then you're the only one to credit, now, if you are coping or modifying other people work they must be credited, but, make sure the stuff you are using as a base or guidelines is open content.

Now, regarding the class:

Assassins must abide by the same weapon and armor restrictions as Thieves

Thieves don't have weapon restrictions

Poison: Some guidelines on creation and gathering times and ingredient amount could be useful.

Surprise: I would give them a +1 bonus instead of a chance, as its stand now they have the same chances as a well hidden and prepared character which may be takes as an assassin always being hidden and prepared or not gaining anything from preparing and ambush.

Assassinate: A table with the percentage value could be really helpful to speed mathematics during play and to keep the victim's HD undisclosed. I would go with a d20 table in the style of the Cleric vs. Undead one.
Another option if you like 3.x style rules is to do a d20+level vs 10+level.

Disguise: It need a little more description on what exactly the roll makes.

Abilities: Although it has 2 less skills, it has a higher value on most of them (at 1st level it hides and sneak like a 5th level Thief) and the overall amount of points is higher than that of a Thief, and ends up with really high scores. I would use the same amount of points that a thief of equal level here.

Goodness gracious. Other than the title the rest of is of course inspired and taken directly from other sources including the images. What a pain. Okay, I'll just pull it down then cause I have no idea what is considered under the open license or not. One image is from one of the BECMI books, another from S&W, while another is from ACKS. The Assassinate ability is directly from the Masters Set book for the Thug. So yea I have no idea. Do you think its best if I simply create a office document myself as opposed to using the modified template from the BF Assassin?

[Dimirag]

Yes, create one yourself, you can't copy text or tables but you can "mimic" them or twist them enough that it no longer resembles them.

For the art you can use free images that are on the internet or wait to see if somebody draws something for your supplement.

[cbarchuk]

Yes, create one yourself, you can't copy text or tables but you can "mimic" them or twist them enough that it no longer resembles them.

For the art you can use free images that are on the internet or wait to see if somebody draws something for your supplement.

Will do. Yes all the art is what I found on the internet.

[cbarchuk]

Hey Dimirag, let me get your feedback on something. This is the one shot kill ability from the Thug...

Thugs have an easier time surprising opponents succeeding on a 1-4. If successful the victim may be slain with a single blow, regardless of hit points. No Hit roll is made; instead, the base chance of success is 50%, modified by the difference in Hit Dice, as follows: if the victim’s level is greater than the Assassin's, subtract 5% per Hit Die; if the victim’s level is less than the Thug's, add 5% per Hit Die. If the Thug does not gain surprise, a normal Hit roll is made, and normal damage is inflicted if the attempt succeeds. Only a one-handed bladed weapon may be used.

Does this sound like it includes backstab? The Thug description states it has all the thief abilities. Does normal damage here include backstab? The implication is if surprise is achieved than the percentile chance can be rolled to instantly kill the target. Otherwise a normal hit roll is made followed by a normal damage rolled. I assume this could include backstab no?

Oh the weapon and armor restrictions part is simply stating exactly what it says: What a thief can use is the same for the assassin. I can reword it to spell out exactly what can be used. But this is how its worded in the BF version.

Poison is the chance to concoct poisons however the ingredients are acquired. This is left open ended just like it is in the original BF version. Poison can be a point of contention for many DMs so I would rather leave it up to the DM. So whether the assassin buys/finds ingredients or extracts poison from a creature of sorts he has a chance to make 1d6 doses of poison.

Disguise is the chance to succeed. Simple. DM decides how many times it needs to be rolled and if any penalties should be applied. DM fiat.

Though I appreciate the feedback I prefer the surprise bonus though a 1-3 could be done instead and I also prefer how the Assassination ability is done as mentioned above.

The increase in stealth is on purpose. This is taken from John Rothwell's Assassin from White Dwarf 77'. It makes sense as stealth is the main focus of the Assassin. The bonus here is 20% higher than the thief. Climb Walls is the same. Point count doesn't matter to me ultimately. If the assassin loses Pick Pockets, Find/Remove Traps, Pick Locks, and Hear Noise then a bump in stealth is justified in my view.

I'm drawing from original source material as much as possible which includes the Thug, John Rothwell's Assassin, and the 0e/1e Assassin. Now the Thug has the same abilities as the thief. I personally don't like that so I went with the Rothwell approach for skills. The thief will still be the main dungeoneering class.

[Dimirag]

Does this sound like it includes backstab? The Thug description states it has all the thief abilities. Does normal damage here include backstab? The implication is if surprise is achieved than the percentile chance can be rolled to instantly kill the target. Otherwise a normal hit roll is made followed by a normal damage rolled. I assume this could include backstab no?

I take the "normal" damage as not a backstab, because backstab is a special situation, and required surprise that is denied in this situation.

Oh the weapon and armor restrictions part is simply stating exactly what it says: What a thief can use is the same for the assassin. I can reword it to spell out exactly what can be used. But this is how its worded in the BF version.

Yes but the Thief has no restriction, that part on the Assassin supplement is an old error. It basically says that the Thief has weapon restriction, but it does not.

Poison is the chance to concoct poisons however the ingredients are acquired. This is left open ended just like it is in the original BF version. Poison can be a point of contention for many DMs so I would rather leave it up to the DM. So whether the assassin buys/finds ingredients or extracts poison from a creature of sorts he has a chance to make 1d6 doses of poison.

The other Assassin has a base cost at least, your take is too loose leaving lots of info in the GM hands.

Disguise is the chance to succeed. Simple. DM decides how many times it needs to be rolled and if any penalties should be applied. DM fiat.

The bold part should be added to the ability description

Though I appreciate the feedback I prefer the surprise bonus though a 1-3 could be done instead and I also prefer how the Assassination ability is done as mentioned above.

If by "surprise bonus" yo mean a bonus added to the chances, I prefer that, its easier to use with the actual surprise rules.
If you don't mind making calculations for the assassination chances then go ahead, I would recommend that the chances are kept secret from the assassin as to not reveal HD/Level info.

[cbarchuk]

Okay I uploaded a version on the first page. I come from an Old School Background where a lot of things are left up to the DM. I prefer it. Some don't. I did add few things to flesh out the poison skill a bit more. I think there's enough there now to cover the basics. The original BF rules say 500gp for buying ingredients. Most DM's are going to alter the cost anyways based on how powerful the poison is as 500gp is nothing. Save or die poison should be quite expensive while something weaker such as the optional rule in the book should be much cheaper. I think the DM can easily decide what kind of poison is best suited for their game. I could list some specific prices but I would just be pulling from either 1e or LL.

I mentioned the backstab thing because backstab doesn't necessarily require surprise. This Assassinate ability specifically requires surprise not just the target being unaware. The 1e and advanced LL version of the Assassin both have backstab in addition to Assassinate. I realize that BF is closer to BX so giving the Assassin both may not be prudent. The Thug listing says it has all Thief abilities.

I clarified the weapons and armor part.

Again I'm not trying to reinvent the wheel here. Obviously there are some house rules needed since there is no Assassin in BX/BECMI. The closet thing we have is the Thug. But the 0e, and 1e version can also give some insight on how the class should work. Here's my thought process overall...

Skills follow the Rothwell version from 77' White Dwarf which gave the Assassin a Hide & Move Silently value of a Hobbit Thief +10% equally 20%. I like this limited but focused set of skills. Leave the big 4 (Open Locks, Pick Pockets, Find & Remove Traps) to the thief.
Assassinate ability from the Thug. This is roughly the same in 1e and LL.

[chiisu81]

Cbarchuk: with future revisions please be sure to add "-r[x+1]" to your filename, and update the attachment in the first post. Thanks!

File re-named and re-uploaded to first post.
Please be sure to keep the filename, and increment the release number on subsequent uploads/updates.

[cbarchuk]

Ah sorry about that. I'm not used to doing it.

[cbarchuk]

Hey Dimirag,

I added some Assassination alternatives to the first post. I'm sure you agree that many don't like instant kill abilities. They're hard to balance anyways and somewhat redundant with being able to use poison. So I added essentially an enhanced backstab for folks that prefer it.

1. Backstab as a thief but the Assassin adds his level to the total damage.
2. Backstab as a thief but has a x3 multiplier.
3. Backstab as a thief but if surprised is achieved then the opponent must roll a saving throw vs. death or take quadruple damage. If the saving throw is successful then double damage is inflicted as normal.

[cbarchuk]

Changed the format a bit. Added a few things based on Dimirags recommendation.