Player Compendium

Creating game materials? Monsters, spells, classes, adventures? This is the place!
daryen
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Re: Player Compendium

Post Thu Dec 17, 2020 3:30 pm

Dimirag wrote: Thu Dec 17, 2020 3:10 pm
But the problem is, once you start compiling anything, it's hard to avoid making editorial decisions.
My point precisely, when somebody compiles something, its based on what that person chooses to compile, that's fine if its done privately, once you put it for other people, you are short-cutting their available options.
And here is where I fundamentally disagree. When I compile something, yes, I am choosing what to include and what to exclude. (That I offload this choice is secondary.) That is true. However, I am in no way imposing anything on anyone else's options. When I created this document, I compiled it and made it available to others. If they like it, great. If they don't, they don't have to use it. I have not touched any of the original files. I have not removed any of the other files. I am imposing nothing on anyone. I am simply offering an additional file that didn't exist before for use if anyone wants to use it. That's it.

As long as this file doesn't show up on Downloads, then nothing has been endorsed by anyone. It is simply a convenient compilation people can either use or not use.
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Dimirag
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Re: Player Compendium

Post Thu Dec 17, 2020 3:37 pm

daryen wrote: Thu Dec 17, 2020 3:22 pm Let me provide two very deliberately chosen examples:
- With Necromancer, I could identify what I thought were issues (primarily the lack of spells), and then submit updates to that specific document for acceptance or rejection. And, if accepted, I get to see that specific document updated.
- With Fey-Mage, I have no real avenue to update that document. To the point that I ended up simply creating a whole new document with an expanded version, Blood Heritage Sorcerer. If Fey-Mage was on the Documents page, I would likely have asked to expand it into what I call Blood Heritage Sorcerer. But that avenue was closed to me, so I took the path I did.
But the Necromancer and Fey Mage are both Smoot's creation, you could go to the Fey Mage and post suggestions there and he would reply the same way that with his Necromancer, .
The real difference is the upload time, Download Page items must be uploaded by Solo, he could have a say about such edition but I'm surely he respect what other people want to do with their creations.

Take for example Smoot's Quasi-classes, the file from the Download page is obsolete, the upgraded one is on the Showcase, this does not means that Solo think the old one is better, but rather that he has other priorities for that page, mainly adventures.
Sorry for any misspelling or writing error, I am not a native English speaker
Drawing portfolio: https://www.instagram.com/m.serena_dimirag/
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Dimirag
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Re: Player Compendium

Post Thu Dec 17, 2020 3:43 pm

Nobody says you are imposing something, but as a result of several discussions it was reached the conclusion that compiled rules would be seen as if above individual stuff as some may see the Download as if above the Showcase.

In Basic Fantasy, what you put is more important than what you not.
Sorry for any misspelling or writing error, I am not a native English speaker
Drawing portfolio: https://www.instagram.com/m.serena_dimirag/
daryen
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Re: Player Compendium

Post Thu Dec 17, 2020 3:57 pm

Dimirag wrote: Thu Dec 17, 2020 3:37 pmBut the Necromancer and Fey Mage are both Smoot's creation, you could go to the Fey Mage and post suggestions there and he would reply the same way that with his Necromancer, .
The real difference is the upload time, Download Page items must be uploaded by Solo, he could have a say about such edition but I'm surely he respect what other people want to do with their creations.
I said that I chose those two examples very deliberately. ;)

I dunno. I was able to get Druid, Necromancer, Illusionist, Spellcrafter, 0 Level Spells, and New Spells updated in a surprisingly short amount of time. The only thing outstanding is a very minor change to Spellcrafter that I found much later (which understandably has very low priority).

We'll see how things go with Libram Magica. In its own way, it is more ambitious than even New Spells, but it is going to need more community help to get done.
daryen
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Re: Player Compendium

Post Thu Dec 17, 2020 4:03 pm

Dimirag wrote: Thu Dec 17, 2020 3:43 pm Nobody says you are imposing something, but as a result of several discussions it was reached the conclusion that compiled rules would be seen as if above individual stuff as some may see the Download as if above the Showcase.
Well, I did see Downloads as more "official" than Showcase for the reasons I have mentioned up-thread. I now get that was an incorrect conclusion. But a compilation, particularly something NOT posted in Downloads, isn't really going to make or break that assumption. I mean, if Solo did the compilation, sure. Maybe even if Chii did. But, me? Nah, it's just something some rando did being offered in case someone else thinks its useful.
In Basic Fantasy, what you put is more important than what you not.
Sorry, did not parse this at all.
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Dimirag
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Re: Player Compendium

Post Thu Dec 17, 2020 4:18 pm

I said that I chose those two examples very deliberately. ;)
What I understand from your examples is that you had a way to summit suggestions for the Necromancer but not for the Fey Mage, or doing one is easier than the other, while in fact both follow the same process (difference being in that in order to change a Download file Solo must be asked for that)
Sorry, did not parse this at all.
It comes form Solo saying that what you put on a table, rulebook or supplement is harder to take away than vice-versa.
The idea of not having rule compilations comes from there, not from whom made it or whom may use it.
Sorry for any misspelling or writing error, I am not a native English speaker
Drawing portfolio: https://www.instagram.com/m.serena_dimirag/
daryen
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Re: Player Compendium

Post Thu Dec 17, 2020 5:03 pm

Dimirag wrote: Thu Dec 17, 2020 4:18 pmIt comes form Solo saying that what you put on a table, rulebook or supplement is harder to take away than vice-versa.
The idea of not having rule compilations comes from there, not from whom made it or whom may use it.
Sure, but the rules compilation doesn't replace the other files. So, if you only want to use Druid and Illusionist, only put those on the table. If you don't care which they use, you can put the compilation on the table. As long as the compilation doesn't replace the individual files, nothing is actually being replaced. It's just another option.
daryen
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Re: Player Compendium

Post Thu Dec 17, 2020 5:16 pm

Dimirag wrote: Thu Dec 17, 2020 4:18 pm
I said that I chose those two examples very deliberately. ;)
What I understand from your examples is that you had a way to summit suggestions for the Necromancer but not for the Fey Mage, or doing one is easier than the other, while in fact both follow the same process (difference being in that in order to change a Download file Solo must be asked for that)
Lemme try with a different example.

If I wanted to submit changes to the Quasi-Classes on the Downloads page, I would discuss the changes with people in the dedicated discussion and determine if the effort was worth it. If it was, I would edit the file and then post the updated document in the Projects folder. At that point Chi, Solo, Alan, and others will take a look at it, decide if it was up to snuff, and either reject it or add it to the queue of things to do.

If I wanted to submit changes to the Quasi-Classes on the Showcase page, I would discuss the changes with people in the dedicated discussion and determine if the effort was worth it. If it was, I would edit the file and then attach the updated document to the discussion thread. At that point, uh, I dunno. Something might happen? The owner of the base file would decide whether those additions were worth it and fit their vision of what they were trying to do? Honestly, I am unclear at this point and am kinda feeling out how things would or wouldn't progress.

So, even if the process is the theoretically the same, it sure doesn't feel like it.
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Dimirag
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Re: Player Compendium

Post Thu Dec 17, 2020 5:42 pm

If I wanted to submit changes to the Quasi-Classes on the Downloads page, I would discuss the changes with people in the dedicated discussion and determine if the effort was worth it. If it was, I would edit the file and then post the updated document in the Projects folder. At that point Chi, Solo, Alan, and others will take a look at it, decide if it was up to snuff, and either reject it or add it to the queue of things to do.
If I'm not mistaken the creator of the file is whom decide if some changes are needed, not other people, Solo has a say on it because the Download page is his own.
It's the same process no matter where the file is located:
-You put your suggestions
-The person that did the file, or you, change if the changes are welcome
-The creator updates the file (or a moderator if the creator is no longer available or wants to speed things up), if its a Download page file its send to Solo to upgrade.
Sorry for any misspelling or writing error, I am not a native English speaker
Drawing portfolio: https://www.instagram.com/m.serena_dimirag/
daryen
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Re: Player Compendium

Post Thu Dec 17, 2020 8:30 pm

Dimirag wrote: Thu Dec 17, 2020 5:42 pm
If I wanted to submit changes to the Quasi-Classes on the Downloads page, I would discuss the changes with people in the dedicated discussion and determine if the effort was worth it. If it was, I would edit the file and then post the updated document in the Projects folder. At that point Chi, Solo, Alan, and others will take a look at it, decide if it was up to snuff, and either reject it or add it to the queue of things to do.
If I'm not mistaken the creator of the file is whom decide if some changes are needed, not other people, Solo has a say on it because the Download page is his own.
It's the same process no matter where the file is located:
-You put your suggestions
-The person that did the file, or you, change if the changes are welcome
-The creator updates the file (or a moderator if the creator is no longer available or wants to speed things up), if its a Download page file its send to Solo to upgrade.
Just to be clear, that's not what happened when I updated the Downloads files. Granted that I think Solo originally created the Druid and Illusionist supplements, but from what I could tell it was Solo's decision for all of them, not just those two. It worked how I outlined it in my post.

Maybe I missed something, but all of the documents were handled the same irrespective of the original author.

Likewise, if by some miracle, the Blood Heritage Sorcerer was deemed worth moving to the Downloads page, I would expect that I would lose control over the document as it would then be managed by Solo and the editors, not me. Which is kind of the point, I would think.
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